Heroes Discussion

[Dark Witch.]

Well I guess I will start the conversation....

I just started watching Heroes. I have only seen the first and second season, and am trying to sort of catch up with the third. I like the series alot. I really like Sylar. His character is unique, and very complex I think. The way they all interlace is also a concept I think it very well done. Ummm...until this conversation draws anywhere, just tell your views of things here!

[Quiet Desperation]

I also started watching Heroes a while ago. It was seaosn two, though. I really enjoyed watching it. It was just a fresh show with great acting and scripts. I would love to watch season one if its on somewhere.

[Dark Witch.]

I am starting to watch season 4: Fugitives, i am excited to see what is happening. I would also like to see how this season plays out...hmmm...hehe.

I don't know where to find another channel where Heroes is played, sorry Manar...

[Temporal Death]

Characters that appealed to me were:

Peter Petrelli (Season One)
Elle Bishop (Season Two & Season Three; way up to "Eris Quod Sum", after which they killed her character)
Sylar (Season Three Onward)
HRG (Seasons One & Two)
Angela Petrelli (Season Three)
Niki Sanders (Seasons One & Two)

I feel that Tim Kring chewed up all of the ideas posed for Volume Three, swallowed them, and shat them out undigested and unruly. The volume had more potential than any of the others, the storytelling was beyond bad.

I would have preferred had "Villains" spanned 20+ episodes, as I feel he crammed up all of the storylines together in half the number.

Fugitives, was, definitely, better than Volume Three, but Heroes has a long way to go to get back to where it was in Volume One, and Brian Fuller walking in and out of the writing room as and when he feels like will result in fluctuating episode quality.

[Terry]

I have a question for people who've seen season 3. I've recently started watching the DVDs and I noticed that there were bits of scenes in the "Previously's" that weren't actually in the previous episodes. At first I just thought I hadn't payed attention but it's happened several times and since it's on DVD, as soon as I'm distracted I rewind, so I CAN'T have missed so many "key" bits. I can't remember them all, but one was when Claire found the Pinehearst card at the puppeteer's place, when she and Sandra went to save Meredith. Well, in the actual episode, I never saw her find that card, and if I'd not watched the "Previously", I would have been WTF!? when she showed it to Elle... so that bothers me cause I don't really like to watch the Previously's unless it's been a few days since I last watched an episode. So I guess my question is, has anyone else noticed that? I mean, hell, the stories are complicated enough as it is without missing bits of them :s

[Temporal Death]

I went over the bits again, and yes, it is a deleted scene (which they haven't included, conveniently). This season/volume was a mess to be honest, and I never knew you watched. However, someone over at /HeroesWiki noticed this when the episode first aired. It has remained unresolved though, but they do have an explanation as to where she saw it before.

On a general note, how do you feel about the show on a whole, and the respective volumes? I know I've had lengthy discussions about it with Tash on MSN, and I would surely love to hear yours.

[Terry]

If only it were the only missing bit! Just today I noticed another of those:

SPOILER: Click to show

When Danko tells Sylar he can take Agent Taub's identity. That was in the previously too but not in the actual episode (Turn and Face Strange, I think).

As for the one about the Pinehearst card, well I know where she got it -- she found it at Doyle's place so it's clear A. Petrelli tried to recruit him, too. But still, I had to watch every single "Previously" of this season and it bothered me.

Yeah, I don't discuss much about Heroes. The reason is the DVDs do have the English language but not the English subtitles so I got a hard time understanding everything. That means I have to watch them in French and I don't like discussing things in English if I only know the French version -- I'm constantly afraid of making mistakes (for instance, "Elle" becomes "Ella" in French because "elle" means "she" so they couldn't really call her She Bishop).

But anyway, I think it's a decent enough show. Not on the top of my list, and I find the flying scenes absolutely horrible lol but overall it's a nice watch. Except for some very confusing storylines.

I just hated Nathan. Ugh. I wished I could punch him in the face several times over. And Sylar. Man, bipolar much? The thing I find fascinating is the genetics and all that crap involved -- I totally suck at biology/chemistry/physics so I'm a bit baffled by all that. So it's not a bad thing I have to watch it in French because not understanding things in French is one thing, but not understanding them in English is quite another...

[Temporal Death]

I believe Sylar is a really interesting character, and before Volume Three, well, before "The Eclipse Part II" at least, I'd have pegged him down as "multitudes of grey", but then, yup, Bipolar. I think the entire premise of V3 had so much promise, even the pre-season spoilers that didn't play out at the end. I have these Elle, Sylar and Peter pieces dealing with storylines in my very own Volume Three, and I have yet to finish them, but don't find the motivation, lol. I would have done an entire script-style alternate season really, but the diversity Heroes initially presented can't all be written up by a single fan unless they know about the social and cultural behavior of those places where all of these characters come from.

I, too, liked it for the genetics and behavioral aspects they potrayed, as well as them actually being somewhat organic characters in Season One. For example, Sylar is a psychopathic killer and although he has alot of blood on his hands, he hesitates when he paints himself destroying NY, and calls someone for help. Then there was Niki, a single mother who gets herself into deep sh!t while trying to make ends meet, and needs to find her inner strength to stand up to these things. That strength manifests itself in the form of her alter ego Jessica, (whom I miss dearly), who finally ends up dissolving into the Niki persona, having the character finally evolve.

The show really had potential, and as seen above, makes me rant my head off (and that's the tip of the iceberg, lol).

[Terry]

Yeah, I actually liked Volume 3 Sylar. It's just the

SPOILER: Click to show

I'm good/I'm bad

bipolarity that got on my nerves in the end, just to have him be back to starting point!

I've found out that talking to people about an idea generally makes me want to be writing it as I speak so you might wanna try that.

And it's true that there are so many different people from so many different places that it'd be hard going but I believe it could still be done, if you analyzed properly the characters as they are before you take over -- then you can make them go wherever you want them to. There's also Wikipedia. I know it's not flawless, but it can offer generalities, at the least.

And, ah Peter! I hate that

SPOILER: Click to show

they gave him that stupid one-power-at-a-time travesty of his initial power he already had so hard a time saving the world with so many powers, what can he do now? I'm whining, but hell, I liked his power so much.

That's what I hate the most about that show, I think. That feeling that, most of the time, they offer us glimpses of the future, or possibilities, just to bring us back to where it all started. They'd brought that probable rampage of his because of Sylar's power, just to end it prematurely.

I miss Niki, too. Frankly, I don't see why they couldn't "bring the character further" or whatever it was they said to justify "Barbara and Tracy". Sure, Tracy has cool powers but we barely had time to see the real, "evolved" Niki so I'm not buying the "not going anywhere" excuse.

Apparently, I can rant my fingers sore, too

[Temporal Death]

I think what killed the show was the whole formula crap. It would be interesting if Zimmerman (dunno what he's called in your dub) told Tracy that she was actually a clone of Niki's, or vice versa. There was also a picture in his home with the German (the magnetic guy) who was his )adopted?) son, with Barbara, his adopted daughter. There was also a line in the premiere where Tracy says "You don't pay me for the sex, Governer. That I do for free" or something along those lines, which added much more depth to her character, albeit in a demeaning nature.

I don't know if you've finished with Volume 5 but

SPOILER: Click to show

I was really hoping for Samuel to split the Earth or NY up with his terrakinesis, and have the future play out for once, but that never happened. I've seen five year old girls who make braver choices than the writers on Heroes.

If this show does come back for another season, they better pace it well, and remove all the fluff crap. And for once, like S1, take braver steps into developping the characters and story.

[Terry]

I've not seen any of Volume 5, except for that one-minute sneak peek at the end of the Season 3 finale.

SPOILER: Click to show

Where we see Tracy isn't dead and is on a killing spree against her former jailers & Sylar-turned-Nathan noticing a clock in the latter's office is off.

But yeah, I guess that without the whole formula plot, the story would have gone in a totally different (better?) direction. That talk of catalyst totally threw me off. I mean, for I don't know how many episode they let us think that it's Claire, so that made me think that the catalyst only appeared 17 years ago. But if that were the case, then how could they create Niki, her sisters, and Nathan and all the others? Until they showed that the catalyst existed prior to that, I was totally thinking they'd made that huge continuity mistake And again, what what the whole point of it, for it to end like that, with the catalyst vanishing forever? *sigh*

Edit: And the Doc's called Zimmerman, too. No need to change that, I guess, eh. I don't think that, except for Elle/Ella, there are that many changes to characters' names. It's just the episode titles, obviously, and some things like the powers or nicknames (HRG, for one... I had absolutely no idea what that meant. It was constantly written everywhere in the little summaries of each episode on the back of the DVD boxes, but I just had no idea who that was until I checked on the web. They NEVER call him HRG in the French dub so why bother writing it on the DVDs at all *sigh*)

[Temporal Death]

Yeah, like I've said before, perhaps the Volume woule be better if it were stretch across a whole season of 22-25 episodes so that character development would seem like development and not repeated episodes of impulsivity.

Though I got to admit, I loved the way the scene was directed/edited at the end of "It's Coming".

Another part of the season that I think was wasted/malhandled was Daphne. I liked her being the speedy Francophone who was finally a match to Hiro in the initial episodes. They completely woobiefied her when they made her lame (literally, that too), and brought Matt into the equation. Had they not brought in the formula and the whole Usutu aspect, I could see her being chased/chasing Hiro and Ando in the current season too.

I realise "had they not" is a phrase I'm using a whole lot in this thread. Or this post. Should create a drinking game out of it. Further emphasizes my dislike to the approach taken to "Villains".

[Terry]

I guess you're right about stretching things out a bit. Look at Matt and Daphne. They barely know each other and two episodes later they're all "I love you" like months or weeks have happened in between.

Actually, they got me when Matt started flying in that later episode. I really thought they'd "found" a way to give him yet another ability. I DID NOT want him to take Pete's place!

And yeah, I guess when you like something you want what is best for it. Though watch out with that game, I doubt you'd take it as good as Claire